The project we are working on is to be built on a land that has been graded as it is part of a national master plan that defines the plot ratio and creates the buildable plots in advance. However, there has never been any structure built there before.
It seems that, from previous comments, previous grading of the site makes it 'previously developed', but in the definition of your website it is written that sites with previous clearing and filling are not considered as previously developed.
Which case are we in, and how confident can we be that this site is considered 'previously developed'?
Thanks!
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Ellen Mitchell
331 thumbs up
March 4, 2013 - 10:06 am
The November 2011 addenda that is referenced in the above FAQs defines prevously developed sites as those that are altered by paving, construction, and/or land use that would typically have required regulatory permitting to have been initiated. Previously developed land includes a platted lot on which a building was constructed if the lot is no more than 1 acre; previous development on lots larger than 1 acre is defined as the development footprint and land alterations associated with the footprint. Land that is not previously developed and altered landscapes resulting from current or historical clearing or filling, agrigultural or forestry use, or preserved natural area use are considered undeveloped land. The date of previous development permit issuance constitutes the date of previous development, but permit issuance in itself does not constitute previous development.
You raise a good point, the original definition of previously developed specifically included sites that were graded but the above definition seems to reverse this when it says land that is altered by current or historical clearing or filling is considered undeveloped land.
Has anyone else dealt with or been affected by this new definition?
Jean-Baptiste Noel
ESD Operations ManagerGreen & Global Consulting Pte. Ltd.
8 thumbs up
March 11, 2013 - 3:36 am
Thanks Ellen,
Just to add to the previous comment, I wonder what happens in the context of urban planning for which a state has authority. In our case, in Singapore, all the plots are part of a Master plan, controlled by state authorities. The site is graded by them, and the plot ratio and usage for the site (Industrial in this case) are pre-determined. Does it mean that basically none of the projects in this situation can be considered as 'previously developed', or all of them?
Thanks.
Tristan Roberts
RepresentativeVermont House of Representatives
LEEDuser Expert
11478 thumbs up
March 20, 2013 - 6:50 pm
In my opinion, I would interpret this with some reference to time. If the grading, etc., occurred years in the past, in anticipation of development, it seems to meet the new definition of previously developed. If done recently with the relevant project being considered, it feels like the definition does not apply.
Ricardo Sá
Director of SustainabilityEdifícios Saudáveis Consultores (503 910 767)
85 thumbs up
March 21, 2013 - 6:38 am
Tristan, can you please explain further why you think that the "reference to time" matters to site classification?
My interpretation to previously developed definition is that a site that had a permit issuance to some alterations that were actually done («altered by paving, construction, and/or land use that would typically have required regulatory permitting») can be considered as previously development regardless of the «alterations may exist now or in the past». It is the date of the permit issuance that should be used («The date of previous development permit issuance constitutes the date of previous development») but it's the actual alterations that qualify the site for this classification («but permit issuance in itself does not constitute previous development»).
Am I interpreting this right?
Tristan Roberts
RepresentativeVermont House of Representatives
LEEDuser Expert
11478 thumbs up
March 21, 2013 - 9:02 am
Pedro, since this is a hypothetical example, it would help to have some specifics to understand better. It's easy to get tied up in confusing knots with hypotheticals.My reference to time is inexact, I admit. But I'm trying to use it as a proxy for LEED project scope, even if work on the site is done by a different entity. I would contend that is a site that is graded and then developed is not previously developed, no matter who does the grading. But if it was graded years ago, that simply seems different.
Ricardo Sá
Director of SustainabilityEdifícios Saudáveis Consultores (503 910 767)
85 thumbs up
March 21, 2013 - 11:46 am
Tristan, I'm aware of the issues that can be raised by hypothetical assumptions, however, I believe my previous comment didn't have any "hypotheticals". I just tried to present my interpretation of the definition applied to this case in particular and was hoping that from here on, others could contribute with their view and actual experience. This is mainly because I don't feel very confident regarding the interpretation of previous developed definition when it comes to sites that don't have construction but had infrastructural alterations prior to acquisition. In that cases I don't understand why time of alteration matters...
Tristan Roberts
RepresentativeVermont House of Representatives
LEEDuser Expert
11478 thumbs up
March 21, 2013 - 12:09 pm
Pedro, sorry that I haven't been able to clarify matters. Perhaps another person on the forum can help, or you could communicate with GBCI about it.