Take Back Programs

great post!....here is what i have been told/experienced: - Who determines what is currently in the existing space (designer or contractor)?  - Packaging up per manufacturer's guidelines slows the pace which adds cost.  - Products can be rejected by manufacturer at time of pickup if not packaged correctly.  - Manufacturers may require a purchase to take back product.  - Complicated requirements of all the various Take Back Programs. - finally, if this is written into the Spec then it is typically the first item on the VE chopping block.  

We are dealing with this right now with a carpet manufacturer's take back program and a university client in Seattle. We were told by the subcontractor that there would be a $100k premium to simply divert the 26,000 square feet of carpet (that is already being demolished/removed with its own cost) to the manufacturer take back program. The carpet company's requirements are simple and clear. The subcontractor claims they will need one added dumpster for the take back program diverted material. Overall, it would be good if manufacturers could coordinate their programs with the subcontractors performing the demolition/diversion. Sometimes, it seems to be out of the control of the General Contractors and the subs are charging unecessary premiums, possibly to avoid dealing with the programs.     Chris Hellstern Miller Hull 

Hey Aley, Happy to share our experiences from 2 recent projects that looked into this (one small industrial office in TX, the other a large corporate office renovation in FL).  We heard a lot of the same feedback Dave shared regarding added cost/labor, but were able to work these into our budgets by helping the preconstruction team do the early research and understand the scope. Our bigger barrier on both projects, but particularly the FL office, was actually the manufacturer requirements themselves.  In the case of both ceiling & carpet, we had a new vs existing mismatch: existing ACT from Company A, but new spec'ed by Company B, and the same with carpet.  We found that the Company B wouldn't take back someone else's products, but the Company A wouldn't take back their own existing material because we weren't purchasing new product from them.  This took multiple phone calls/emails with each to iron out the details, and contact info wasn't as easy to find for some manufacturers as others.  Long story short, the proprietary nature of takeback programs was the hold-up for us more than construction-related issues (but coming from a unique position working for a design arm of a construction company).  Feel free to PM me if you want to chat further! Kaitlin

From a contractor who has used several different takeback programs, I can say the following:

1. If a takeback program isn't called out on the demo drawings with language in the specs, it's going to be seen as an "expensive" or "infeasible" option. If you are a desinger, call these items out on the documents.
   1. If it get's VE'd or considered for VE'd, it's probably an unfamiliar contractor who doesn't understand that you can save money on these programs.
2. Manufacturers are risk adverse and most have takeback programs in name only, as their requirements (in my opinion) are purposefully hard to accomplish.
   1. Certainteed requires full ACT samples to be sent to them for testing, have really high quantity miniumums for returns, and require you buy equal or more of their ACT to be considered.
   2. Interface, Mohawk and other carpet takeback programs require minimum sq. ft. of the same product, which for most jobs will never hit.
   3. Some programs do nothing to offset the costs of pickup, giving literally no incentive other than "do the right thing for the planet". If I have to pay the same (or more!?) for takeback, why would any owner want to do that?
   4. If I need to submit a hazardous material report, but there never was any inclination of hazards or testing in the building, try convincing an owner to pay a couple thousand for an inspection and spot test just to save 2-3 dumpster hauls.
   5. Most manufacturers only want their product back, and I have many interior projects where I can have 3-4 different manfuacturers spec'd for carpet or ACT. As a desinger, keep it consistent and simple!
3. The most successful programs work with the contractor to assist. I have worked with Shaw and Armstrong on several projects now and they have been very helpful, working with the team to organize the pickups, providing spec guidelines and packaging requirements beforehand.
   1. With support and (free) pickup, I have made the case on 3 different projects that they can save money and carbon on these programs. The sub upcharge costs to palletize and wrap the ACT or carpet tile are far below the disposal cost savings, but it needs to be a requirement in the bid scope and contract language. Plus, the client was over the moon about it!

While I love the challenge of making these programs work, I would beware attempting these programs at the 11th hour/post bid and asking contractors who very clearly don't want to do this. I saw Chris' post regarding the $100k upcharge for 26k sf of carpet tile takeback and I am certain that the sub/contractor threw a purposefully large number at him. Maybe the sub didn't want to do it, maybe it wasn't on the drawings, maybe the carpet was from a manufacturer who wants the LEED points for a program and nothing more, maybe it's all of them combined. But I have utilized carpet take backs (Shaw) for 25k sf, 40k sf and 58k sf and saved money on all three by getting in early and making sure the demo sub fully understood it was a requirement and not an add alt. The tide is changing though, as last month I had Armstrong reach out to me to ask about taking back ACT from a project in Delaware. Maybe desingers need to grill manufacturers on circularity and start rewarding the ones that actually are pushing the needle?

We have written into our demolition general notes to 1) identify the existing materials (carpet and ceiling tiles), 2) include in the bid a line item for landfill (that has a cost too!) and a line item for packaging for pick up, and includes contact info for each program (yes, I picked a phone number for 2 manufacturers, there are more). I have actually never seen these bid line items filled out, but there's only so much we can control, right? (for the record, the majority of our projects are TI renovations) If I ever get an actual kick off meeting with a contractor (rare in the fast-turnaround world of TIs), I would make a point of walking through these notes to ensure they are acted upon. 

Regionality is a factor, where the material is being removed in proximity to the manufacturers take-back program. Cost to the contractor/subcontractor is also relevant beyond trade parter markup on labor for a new practice. When quantities do not meet manufacturers thresholds, transportation costs often fall on the contractor/subcontractor which are typically greater than the cost of disposal. The tenant improvement market segment frequently falls short of these quantity requirements. Including diversion of existing finish materials from landfill through manufacture take-back programs in the specifications is ideal. Simplifying the process to initiate take-back programs and integrating participation/execution in projects from design conception will maximize impact.